Tony Abbott (2 Viewers)

[hayabusaboston]

Re: Tony Abott

You mean how there are multiple reports of sexual assaults and issues of depression amongst kids in the detention centre? You mean maybe the guards we paid are doing jack shit in ensuring security, you know one of the duties we have? You mean how the govt is threatening to jail medical staff and social workers who 'leak' information?

It's easy to sit back and say 'if you don't like it don't come' when most of these people don't have a choice. They have no homes. Their entire livelihoods are at risk. Their neighborhoods and loved ones are dead and they have to get out of a warzone to survive. We do have an obligation to uphold basic human rights, yet we are not. That is the problem. Read ANY of the reports written out. Don't give me this BS that Gillian Triggs is some lefty out to criticize the gov. Funny how she was appointed by the abbot government to be the head of the human rights commission, which if you knew anything is PART of the EXECUTIVE. The entire point of the human rights commission is to tell the government where they fucked up. They're not there to pat each other on the back otherwise it'd defeat their entire point of existence.

Most refugees do assimilate. Just ask all your greek, lebanese, vietnamese, serbian, croatian, bosnian etc or anyone with an ethnic background. They didn't exactly come here because they wanted to, they came here because they had to escape their wartorn lives and a lot of them are escaping straight out genocide.

Question for you.

Do you see these ethnic groups being oppressed/violated/treated like shit in detention centres?



Ask yourself why is it only SOME refugees cause shit to go down and others dont? Then you'll know where the problem is.


and *gasp* sexual assaults, depression, violence in detention centres, but who is doing it? Ye m8 its the white australians you guessed it. Its entirely the fault of australia and its ppl for letting this happen. If you didnt catch the sarcasm, that means that its other refugees causing the problems.

You are saying essentially if two dogs are ripping each others throats out its australias fault for not putting in security measures to prevent this. Do you even realise how utterly ridiculous that sounds? and its actually disturbing how many BoS'ers like your post in agreement lol. But whatever. Dogs are dogs m9 incase you havent noticed.

Lemme guess, you are now going to immediately label me "ULTRA RACIST BIGOT HATE SPEECH CVNT" because you're going to claim I am calling refugees dogs. Which is so wrong its funny, like construing from 2+2=4 that 3+2 must also equal four. Pls, save yourself embarrassment lol. Dogs and their behaviours I just used as an analogy for cultural/religious behaviours, to put it as simply as possible for your limited understanding of what I say. Now I get the feeling you are going to complain how dare I suggest islamic people behave like and are dogs. AGAIN. I DID NOT FUCKING SAY THAT. So pls. Save yourself embarrassment from plucking wrong shit out of the wrong places that doesnt even exist

and hey here's an idea! maybe its a sign? I DONT KNOW, could it be, that maybe certain refugees see their abhorrent behavior as NORMALITY from their cultural and social norms back in their home countries?? Maybe that means its probably not going to end well if you put a bunch of them together in a detention centre? Maybe that means you should consider, I dont know, sending problematic refugees back to where they came from? Unless sure you wanna let in psycopaths murderers and rapists into the country, be my guest. Dont complain afterwards if straya ends up like that "europe 2050" pic though.


I dont read up extensively on this stuff but I know sufficient basics to calculate consequences. If you educate me on your argument and its something I can agree with off my own knowledge or lack thereof then sure im happy to admit you are right. But right now you're far from that tbh lol. Got some work to do on the "coherent" side of things.


YEs it is easy to say so and yes they dont have a choice, that is precisely why they are not in a position to complain or else why is it even in our interest to let in rapists/murderers/psycopaths into australian society and use taxpayer money to pay for them?


You seem to think I am painting all refugees to straya same colour. I would have expected someone of your intellect to realise that is not the case,

Only certain groups of refugees have been repeatedly shown to cause problems, that is the one and only focus here, what to do about them



Heres the thing isildurr, and anyone else who is having any trouble grasping this. The problem with australia and most of the world these days is that everyone is overwhelmingly left-wing inclined. The problem with the left wing and the whole human rights obsession is that it basically aims to save the entire world, without calculating the COST of actually doing so. Meanwhile people more inclined to the right wing not only work to calculate the cost of such ridiculously ambitious endeavours, they realise IT IS NOT FUCKING POSSIBLE TO PLEASE EVERYONE, the fundamental mechanics of human civilization will never permit a predictable world where everything is under control and everyone is on an equal slate.

 

[Sonesful]

ugly af

 

[hayabusaboston]

@hayabusaboston

you are assuming that they are all Muslims on boats it seems to be implying...
or that because they are a different culture they cannot come to Australia (then what is the point of calling it multiculturalism)

some are [Muslims], some aren't (some are actually Hindus, Christians, Bahai, religious minority, non-religious etc.), some are genuinely fleeing for their lives, some are just are trying to escape the rat-race elsewhere...
whether the government is actually doing a decent job of processing those who are actually seeking asylum in Australia for legitimate reasons is questionable at best, and abhorrent (in terms of detention centres) at worst.
---
@INADIKAP95
concerning your link that you posted
"it has emerged that developing countries are the ones bearing the brunt of the problem, hosting as many as four-fifths of the world's refugees."
the reason I quote this is response to your statement "Very near the bottom in the Western world."
In general the Western world overall, is fairly slack when it comes to refugees, in terms of percentages.
this is fairly shocking, and Australia is not excluded.

@hayabusaboston
concerning the quality of the detention centres. I understand what you are saying that they are better comparatively then in developing nations, but then again this doesn't just the poor treatment that does happen or the conditions that are present, they are barely any better, some would argue (I won't because I agree they are slightly better if only just) that they are worst.

@RenegadeMx
It would be funny to leave the situation as it is, except for the fact that Australia has signed all these treaties.
Detention centres and even to some extent, some parts of the prison system in Australia are terrible. Now, in serious cases, the latter would be justifiable for serious crimes. But in all seriousness "rehabilitation" of any sort is a token-word; in the context of detention centres,
"assimilation" or "settlement" is a token word to some regards (as TPVs are temporary and not guaranteed)

You do not seem to be able to grasp what I am conveying, I dont even know where you fucking got that from lol. Refer to my other post.

 

[hayabusaboston]

Re: Tony Abott

I dont really want to get too much into this - there is a lot more better stuff that i could be doing - so ill try make it brief

Not having refugees is not causing problems to Australian people - which is fine - but maybe we should not be selfish and think about others and see how we can help them? It's great and all to keep ourselves happy, but seeing as we are already mostly (unfortunately not as many indigenous people ) doing quite well off in our country, why dont we be kind and help some people out. They are definitely going through a much harder time than we are.

And about the detention centres being bad and stuff, and them going back to where they came from - we have obligations to taking them in as refugees to take care of them to an extent. We have to at LEAST uphold their human rights. These are rights that EVERYONE in the world is meant to have, but sadly not all of us do. This is why people fled their countries, because they had their human rights violated and are looking for asylum and a safe place. They have every right to demand for better care that does not violate human rights!! here they are if you want a refresh: http://www1.umn.edu/humanrts/edumat/hreduseries/hereandnow/Part-5/8_udhr-abbr.htm
Sadly several of our detention centres do not uphold these basic rights that everyone deserves. Child abuse, rape and violence can be quite common - and it should not be this way. Recently a law was passed that prohibited doctors and specialists to inform anyone when they found evidence of child abuse or serious mental health issues (like being suicidal). What the refugees want is to be treated with respect as a fucking human being.

Refer to my other post as well plox. And you spelled it out perfectly well here, aboriginal inequality and injustice is rife in australia

and yet australians complain about treatment of asylum seekers. M8! m888888! the ignorance! so we are to assume you dont give the slightest shit for aboriginals? Australia continually overextends itself, honestly, fix the fucking problem at home before you even CONSIDER "treatment of asylum seekers"

 

[Sien]

So much heat in this thread :/

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

 

[hayabusaboston]

Re: Tony Abott

You described yourself perfectly right there.

aaaand youve proven my point exactly lol.

 

[hayabusaboston]

So much heat in this thread :/

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

so much narrow mindedness too. And the narrow midned ones think YOURE the narrow minded one, which makes it hilarious :') sure I'll admit I dont have all the facts but I'll be happy to change my opinions upon presentation of them. Assuming they are legit facts and not bleeding heart bs of no factual or intellectual substance.

 

[dan964]

You do not seem to be able to grasp what I am conveying, I dont even know where you got that from lol. Refer to my other post.

1.
You are suggesting that certain groups of refugees are responsible for the problems in detention centres, so what?
Do you have any facts to back that claim up that it is isn't actually the situation that others are claiming it is? Obviously criminals should be sent back, but you seem to be implying that only certain cultures/religions (as your "other post(s)" demonstrate) are responsible...

You said "I just used as an analogy for cultural/religious behaviours," and then complained that people would say that you said this about Muslims. Although, yes, you did not particularly name or say anything about them, I got it from what you were directly implying as your original post was in reply to an "angry muslim". If, I might have jumped to a wrong conclusion, but if that it is the case, it is because your argument is not clear

(And if I have, you need to do it a lot better way that you have done)

But your image of "Europe 2050" understanding that in Europe seems to cement that there is some particular culture/religion that you are referring to.

2. Yes I agree the "left" overdoes it (that is why I am not a 'left-wing' person) but then again so are you are overdoing (referring to large text, caps and obscene words to get your case across doesn't look good for you).

3. Concerning your comment regarding Australia's indigenious people (the Aborigines)
It is quite ironic that this is raised, considering this the first white settlers were effectively 'boat people'...

That's all from me.

 

[isildurrrr1]

Re: Tony Abott

Refer to my other post as well plox. And you spelled it out perfectly well here, aboriginal inequality and injustice is rife in australia

and yet australians complain about treatment of asylum seekers. M8! m888888! the ignorance! so we are to assume you dont give the slightest shit for aboriginals? Australia continually overextends itself, honestly, fix the fucking problem at home before you even CONSIDER "treatment of asylum seekers"

I think the same people who are raising issues with treatment of asylum seekers are the same people who do raise issues about treatment of aboriginals, especially those in police custody.

Australia isn't 'left leaning' these days. You know when was our largest refugee intake? Post-ww2 and vietnam. Ever heard of 'populate or perish?'. We've always been a nation of refugees. Every single mass migration towards Australia has always been a result of warfare overseas that destroyed the livelihood of so many.

The problem with the detention centres is that were spending 400k per person keeping them there, since were essentially paying foreign governments to do our dirty work to win bogan votes. Not exactly financially sound is it.

We have a duty of care to uphold when people come to us, even if we 'dont want them here'. We shouldn't treat people worst than we do to animals. It's extremely inhumane and DIBP should actually do their job and asses people for their refugee status and make a decision, instead of leaving people in legal limbo.

Your'e the exact evidence of why this government and the last had their refugee policy in place, simply to win the bogan votes.

 

[nerdasdasd]

Here is my 2 cents.

It's only fair that we accept refugees , because we partook in the bombing missions of the U.S.

Their homes and lives got torn to shreds because of the nations that partook with the U.S. in the invasion of Iraq and the Middle East , so it is obligated for those nations (AUS included ) to take in refugees.

And yeah.

Where else are they gonna go? Their countries is bombed to bits , no tourism or basic services , hospitals are underfunded and the list goes on

 

[isildurrrr1]

Here is my 2 cents.

It's only fair that we accept refugees , because we partook in the bombing missions of the U.S.

Their homes and lives got torn to shreds because of the nations that partook with the U.S. in the invasion of Iraq and the Middle East , so it is obligated for those nations (AUS included ) to take in refugees.

We've been taking in refugees since WW1. Why stop now?

 

[nerdasdasd]

We've been taking in refugees since WW1. Why stop now?

We shouldn't stop now .

 

[Erudite]

Hopeless.... Definitely not going to be re-elected....

 

[hayabusaboston]

We've been taking in refugees since WW1. Why stop now?

I am not suggesting stop, I am suggesting reevaluating how straya goes about processing and maintaining refugees and stopping only certain groups of people who behave inappropriately and show themselves to only be a danger and detriment to Australian society.

 

[hayabusaboston]

I am also actually wondering how many refugees say "thnx for letting me in Australia, I will now get a job to support myself and my family and contribute to society". Genuinely curious the proportions of them that go on to do something with themselves as opposed to kicking back and relaxing on a bed of government money+copulating furiously to get even more bonus cash from government for baby maintenance

 

[Kiraken]

I am not suggesting stop, I am suggesting reevaluating how straya goes about processing and maintaining refugees and stopping only certain groups of people who behave inappropriately and show themselves to only be a danger and detriment to Australian society.

what groups lol?

what do u mean by re-evaluating the "processing and maintaining"?

in fact basically what r u talking about lol

 

[Kiraken]

I am also actually wondering how many refugees say "thnx for letting me in Australia, I will now get a job to support myself and my family and contribute to society". Genuinely curious the proportions of them that go on to do something with themselves as opposed to kicking back and relaxing on a bed of government money+copulating furiously to get even more bonus cash from government for baby maintenance

this happens with ppl born and raised here too do u want to kick them out as well?

That points to a wider issue with out welfare system rather than anything specific to refugees

 

[hayabusaboston]

this happens with ppl born and raised here too do u want to kick them out as well?

That points to a wider issue with out welfare system rather than anything specific to refugees

well we dont need people contributing to the problem now do we m8?

 

[hayabusaboston]

what groups lol?

what do u mean by re-evaluating the "processing and maintaining"?

in fact basically what r u talking about lol

You are actuallly asking these questions? lol isnt it obvious the ones that cause problems? They are of a variety of backgrounds.


and reevaluating the processing and maintaining means doing things LIKE for example getting rid of the aggressive/psycopathic cvnts in detention centres who cause problems, changing how those centres run to increase efficiency and decrease strain on government money. Whatever is found to be something useful to do to just in general improve things tbh.

 

[dan964]

You are actuallly asking these questions? lol isnt it obvious the ones that cause problems? They are of a variety of backgrounds.

and reevaluating the processing and maintaining means doing things LIKE for example getting rid of the aggressive/psycopathic in detention centres who cause problems, changing how those centres run to increase efficiency and decrease strain on government money. Whatever is found to be something useful to do to just in general improve things tbh.

thanks for the clarification > a simple part of the solution would actually to teach them English and "Australian" values.