Merit Grade Distribution Changes (1 Viewer)

Obvious

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I've heard from a less than reputable source that the University may be changing the way grades are distributed. Basically, the new system will involve something along the lines of getting a slightly modified version of your raw mark. To those of you who aren't currently enrolled, this is quite a drastic change from the current 3% HD/15% D etc. method.

Does this individual have any substance behind her claims?
 

Riproot

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I heard this too.

That they were doing some form of criteria thingy. :/
 

izzy88

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Not sure, I don't think I've heard anything (but that wouldn't mean much). But would it depend on the faculty? I was under the impression the faculties were in charge of scaling/distribution curves etc. The effect of it would probably also differ depending on the faculty.

Law only just changed its criteria a couple of years ago (to a lot of angst) to introduce formal bell curving. It was introduced because too many people were getting D's and graduating with first class honours - taking away the bell curve would probably mean we went back to whatever there was before (which to my knowledge, was no formal requirements on how many people could get particular grades). To stop so many people graduating with honours, they introduced the bell curving, and also from next year have a new honours system requiring a thesis and have changed the thresholds for first/second class etc. The new system is more in line with the rest of the university, but I'm so happy I'm graduating under the old one! (old system being: law WAM over 75 = first class etc).
 
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Obvious

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But would it depend on the faculty?
Yeah, I'd guess it probably would.

I should also add that I heard something similar to my original post from a lab demonstrator a few weeks ago. However, I don't remember there being anything said about the introduction of such a system in the near future, which is why I'm asking here.

That they were doing some form of criteria thingy. :/
Hmm... can you explain a bit more? What sort of criteria?
 
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Riproot

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Hmm... can you explain a bit more? What sort of criteria?
You know how in the HSC they have band descriptors for the different bands?

I've heard in the rumour mill that the Maths department was looking at something similar with their grading system.

But I dunno.
 

jet

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We were told in lectures. It's a University-wide policy you can read about here:

http://sydney.edu.au/policies/showdoc.aspx?recnum=PDOC2012/267&RendNum=0

From my reading of it, it seems like they're changing from a model where you are scaled against the performance of your cohort to a model where they set a specific standard for each grade and you're marked against that standard. So it would be possible (I guess) that if every one did horrendously throughout the semester, they might not give out any HD's. Full compliance isn't expected till the end of 2013 but I'm not sure what that means for assessments this semester.
 

Obvious

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We were told in lectures. It's a University-wide policy you can read about here:

http://sydney.edu.au/policies/showdoc.aspx?recnum=PDOC2012/267&RendNum=0

From my reading of it, it seems like they're changing from a model where you are scaled against the performance of your cohort to a model where they set a specific standard for each grade and you're marked against that standard. So it would be possible (I guess) that if every one did horrendously throughout the semester, they might not give out any HD's. Full compliance isn't expected till the end of 2013 but I'm not sure what that means for assessments this semester.
Well, I certainly wasn't :/. Thanks heaps though +1
 

Riproot

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We were told in lectures. It's a University-wide policy you can read about here:

http://sydney.edu.au/policies/showdoc.aspx?recnum=PDOC2012/267&RendNum=0

From my reading of it, it seems like they're changing from a model where you are scaled against the performance of your cohort to a model where they set a specific standard for each grade and you're marked against that standard. So it would be possible (I guess) that if every one did horrendously throughout the semester, they might not give out any HD's. Full compliance isn't expected till the end of 2013 but I'm not sure what that means for assessments this semester.
shit. So what I said was trueish. But they didn't say anything in my lectures. Probs because we're only first years.
 

izzy88

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We were told in lectures. It's a University-wide policy you can read about here:

http://sydney.edu.au/policies/showdoc.aspx?recnum=PDOC2012/267&RendNum=0

From my reading of it, it seems like they're changing from a model where you are scaled against the performance of your cohort to a model where they set a specific standard for each grade and you're marked against that standard. So it would be possible (I guess) that if every one did horrendously throughout the semester, they might not give out any HD's. Full compliance isn't expected till the end of 2013 but I'm not sure what that means for assessments this semester.
Thanks for the link.

When I read it though, it doesn't seem much different to what is always done. In that there are always faculty standards of what is a D, C, or P grade (very general, but found in the beginning of unit outline), and a lecturer normally does mark to that standard, and lecturers do compare marking if different people are marking same cohort; but at the end of that whole process, if there are too many HDs (for example in law, there can be no more than 10%, then they would have to scale some of those marks down to a D grade). To be fair, I have just given it a quick read through, and I haven't compared it to the old policy to really see the differences, so I may have missed a lot of the significant bits! :p

I don't know about other faculties, but in law, there is a minimum of 3% HDs and 10% Ds, I would think it would be very difficult for a subject to give less than that even if bell curving isn't required - it would be hard to justify that a cohort was that much worse than another. The other impact is that a subject could give out all Ds and HDs. But I'm pretty sure the reason the Law bell curve was introduced was to get around the large number of good marks being given out! :p rather than the other way around. I suspect the law students would be quite happy to go back to a non-bell curve system (there was a lot of complaints against the bell curve when it was formally introduced a couple of years ago).

Actually the law distributions are:
Passing grades in undergraduate and JD units shall conform to the following distribution:
4.1 No more than 40% of the students may receive a grade of D or above.
4.2 The range of HD grades must be between 3-10% of the total number of students.
4.3 A minimum of 10% D grades must be awarded.

Edit: And here is a section of Law's reasons as to the moderation of grades:
"The standardisation policy also aims not only to ensure an appropriate degree of fairness and consistency in marking across a particular year, but from year-to-year, to ensure relative stability in the level of marks awarded, and to maintain the integrity of the marks given and to avert “grade inflation” and its consequent impact on the award of honours and ranking on graduation."
 
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alstah

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I'm so happy I'm graduating under the old one! (old system being: law WAM over 75 = first class etc).
Can you please explain to me how the new one works? :O

I thought if you get over 75 you get first class honours still? What will the new system do?
 

izzy88

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Can you please explain to me how the new one works? :O

I thought if you get over 75 you get first class honours still? What will the new system do?
If you are graduating from the end of next year onwards then you fall under a new system to obtain honours. The new system brings it more in line with how honours is done in the rest of the university, however in my opinion, it will be much more difficult.

You can read it here: http://sydney.edu.au/law/cstudent/undergrad/honours_program.shtml

However in summary under the new system you will be required to apply for the honours program in penultimate year, and in 5th year you will enrol in a 12 credit point honours subject in one semester (so worth two subjects, a shell unit). In which you write a thesis of 12,000 words (including footnotes).

From this, the 'HWAM' will then be calculated from a minimum of 90 credit points and a maximum of 136 credit points of law units of study, including all compulsory and elective units of study undertaken at Sydney Law School, with the exception of Foundations of Law. The Honours units will carry a weighting of two while all other units carry a weighting of one.

From this HWAM to obtain honours it will be:
Honours Class I ≥80
Honours Class II 75 to 79
Honours not awarded ≤74

So, in summary - completely different from the current system! And a lot more difficult in my opinion.
 

alstah

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Thanks for that Izzy!

I have a few more questions that don't exactly relate to this thread. I'll send you a message :)
 

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