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Violence erupts in Sydney over anti-Islam film (5 Viewers)

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hobozforlife

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So you attack people in Sydney who have nothing to do with one mans decision on the other side of the world?
Stop making false allegations, I didn't even go to the protest...how cud I attack them then? :S

And I was simply referring to ur so called *freedom of expression*.
 

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People should not talk about religion anyway
what gives religion the exemption? why is it a minefield once the topic shifts to religion? what makes it any different than talking about another persons football team or political view
 

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I haven't watched much footage of the protests, wow those protesters really are scum. In the second video at 1:35, a guy kicks the shit out of a police dog, and then gets up and kicks the dog again, before the police have done anything, why would you that?



Can you name any other group in Australia in the last ten years that staged such violent protests?

It seems like this is the most dangerous and threatening group of people in Australia.
cronulla
macquarie fields
redfern
 

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You always hear people burning QURAN, making cartoons of our PROPHET and what and what not...
I mean srslyy afterdoing all dat you really expect us muslims to sit back with bag of popcorns and watch it happen!
so what, its not like muslims dont go raving on about the western world or make cartoons or slander other religions. why is it okay for muslims to slander others but not okay for others to slander their religion
 

Lolsmith

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People like Lolsmith are no less of a hate-mongerer than an exteme fundamentalist cleric, the violent aggressors seen at the protest or the political activists that Tony Abbott wants so much to fly out of Australia. (Taji Mustafa).
me writing words that may or may not be my actual opinion is the same as assaulting police officers in a violent protest

you heard it here first guys
Please stop hating on Muslims, the more you provoke them and hate them, the more they fear the rest of society and the more trouble you will cause. In the end Athiests fear death, most religious people don't so your fighting a losing battle, by the looks of it, some people are trying to cause a "holocaust #2" - Islamaphobia is starting to look like Nazi Germany. So rather than preaching all this hatred, get to know a religion and its followers before inciting all this hatred. Peace.
This post is permeating with stupidity
EVERY single religion has extremists ...and comeon I have read countless times on newspapers about *children's being raped by someone who are NOT muslims*
Why dont they make videos of them??
@Lolsmith: Just cuz *minority take such a misconstrued version of morals from the quran*, there is CLEARLY something wrong with the people, maybe use your logic?

And stop being ignorant and give SOME evidence against Muhammad (PBUH)??
Isn't it entirely possible that the majority have just forgone the parts of Islam that do preach violence and these men and women are actually following it? Being a part of the majority doesn't make you automatically right.

I did give evidence against him. I can recommend some literature that mentions how Muhammad had a child bride, if you want. Even scholars that were his contemporaries had no worries about him marrying and raping a 9/10 year old.
Seeing as you are so familiar with the documentation, you should then be aware of the documentation supporting the fact that in those times people did used to marry off their daughters that young. This was common amongst nearly every single ancient civilisation.

There was no concept of "teenager" in those times. Boys went to war at a young age. Girls married young and worked young. People died young. Age is somewhat relative to life span.

You also need to consider the notion that an Islamic marriage is not one where sex is such an important facet.
It's almost like you're trying to prove me right!

You see where I said that it would be met with cultural relativism? Yeah you just did that.
Well as long as the woman has reached puberty at the age of 9 or 10, i don't see anything wrong with it. This is an opinion based matter. In some US states the legal age for marriage is as low as 14, in Australia its 18. Point being, the age of acceptance is an issue surrounded by what is morally accepted within society.
People itt that say it's okay to rape kids:
- Muslims

People itt who say it's not all right to rape kids:
- Lolsmith

It has nothing to do with the laws of the time. A child at the age of 9 or 10, whether they were born and raised in the 9th century in the Middle East or Sydney in the 21st century, does not have the faculty to conceptualise the full impact of the act that is being forced upon them. They have no ability to consent to sex because they don't understand it. Since you don't understand how rape works, let me break it down for you. Sexual acts that occur without expressed consent of both parties, for whatever reason whatsoever, is rape. This is regardless of whether other illiterate peasants also want to rape kids or not.
Well as long as the woman has reached puberty at the age of 9 or 10, i don't see anything wrong with it. This is an opinion based matter. In some US states the legal age for marriage is as low as 14, in Australia its 18. Point being, the age of acceptance is an issue surrounded by what is morally accepted within society.
The law doesn't necessarily reflect morality and using it as a point to do so is fallacious.

its still going on..

@lolsmith. m8. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vw903mGrkKY

heres your proof for media portraying muslims in a wrong way ALL THE TIME.
(i don't support the protests, i think its fucking stupid, pointless and disgraceful - so does every other muslim guy/girl I know - THOSE people there are just looking for something to "fight for religion"- when there is nothing.
"all the time"

sample size: 1

Not really. The text that documents Aisha's age as 9 or 10 at the time of consummation is Bukhari's Hadith, you only have to read it to realise it is hugely inconsistent in terms of dates. For example it also states that Aisha's sister Asma, who was 10 years older, died at the 73rd Hijra at 100 years old, which would have made Aisha 19 years old at the time her marriage was consummated. Furthermore, she participated in the Battle of Uhud, where people under the age of 15 were prohibited, again indicating that she was at least 19 at the time of consummation.

There are several other pieces of evidence that point at her being around 19 at the time of consummation by many other historians. In fact, this age is actually more consistently represented in historical texts, it's just that Bukhari is the most famous (and ironically the most inconsistent) one.

The hadith are not really considered essential or 100% fact by many Muslims, because they are historical accounts that are not considered the word of Allah. In fact, some Muslims are outright against the Hadith as the Qur'an strictly states that everything in Islam is in the Qur'an, so any other text is deemed irrelevant.

Also I do not see how this is in any way relevant to the riots tbh
You are a compliment to your people.

It has nothing to do with it, but it's hilarious watching really dumb people trip over themselves trying to defend having sex with kids. Seriously, that is what one of these idiots literally just did.
Hey we're forgetting context here. This hapenned over 1400 years ago and was a norm amongst both the muslim and non muslim community at that time.
The point is that you still consider Muhammad the one that should be emulated because of his moral superiority and connection with Allah. i.e: it's okay to fuck kids because the prophet did
 
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hobozforlife

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what gives religion the exemption? why is it a minefield once the topic shifts to religion? what makes it any different than talking about another persons football team or political view
Obviously your lack of knowledge on our religion....how hard was dat to guess? :O

And ehh football team is played by HUMAN BEINGS, just like u and I, thus they make MISTAKES.
Please atleast get something compar-able!

so what, its not like muslims dont go raving on about the western world or make cartoons or slander other religions. why is it okay for muslims to slander others but not okay for others to slander their religion
Provide evidence maybe?
 
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@lolsmith- "Isn't it entirely possible that the majority have just forgone the parts of Islam that do preach violence and these men and women are actually following it?" Thats where u seem to have gone wrong. Where is it that says islam supports violence. Islam has never, nor will it ever support violence.
 

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Stop making false allegations, I didn't even go to the protest...how cud I attack them then? :S

And I was simply referring to ur so called *freedom of expression*.
Are you trolling or what? By using the term "us muslims" within the context of your proceeding post, you created the implication that you yourself are of the view that retaliation is warranted and it is therefore not a stretch to make that assumption.

Well why doesnt he go and exercise his *freedom of expression* on other religions!!
Geez people leave us innocent muslims alone :rolleyes:

You always hear people burning QURAN, making cartoons of our PROPHET and what and what not...
I mean srslyy afterdoing all dat you really expect us muslims to sit back with bag of popcorns and watch it happen!

hmm ye-ah I guess I got my point across, now go and study for ur HSC!
 

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You always hear people burning QURAN, making cartoons of our PROPHET and what and what not...
I mean srslyy afterdoing all dat you really expect us muslims to sit back with bag of popcorns and watch it happen!
No, by all means you can criticise the video, but how the fuck is killing innocent people, burning and vandalising schools and shops and holding signs promoting further violence (including giving a 4 year old kid a sign calling for decapitation) as well as violently attacking police in other countries and in general acting like a bunch of animals achieving any sort of agenda apart from making the world judge the Muslim population even more than they already do.

Can you blame the media? Maybe they do exaggerate certain things, I don't know and don't pretend to be informed of the "exact truth". What I do know however is that a lot of the time they criticise the actions of Muslims in the world it is because a bunch of extremists such as the ones responsible for this violent behaviour have given them an opportunity to criticise Muslims. Give the media no opportunity to criticise you, by acting like civilised people, and they will not.
 

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Obviously your lack of knowledge on our religion....how hard was dat to guess? :O

And ehh football team is played by HUMAN BEINGS, just like u and I, thus they make MISTAKES.
Please atleast get something compar-able!
well it looks like allah can fuck up even harder by letting the US into the middle east and letting the other religions other than islam spread or letting so many of his people die at the hands of infidels. why do you continually pour your trust into something that has given you nothing. religion is nothing more than an ideology just like one's political views, yet you dont see the right wings or left wings rioting when caricatures of their leaders are made.

also how does my knowledge of islam affect the exemption of religion to public opinions
 
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hobozforlife

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Hey so you know how a bunch of muslims in Libya *murdered* a US diplomat and a few other US citizens?

Yeah
Well i dont blv in *life for life*, and our religion strictly prohibits it.
But how about thousands of muslims being raped and murdered in Burma..and let me tell you dats not the ONLY country where muslims are being tortured.
 
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hobozforlife

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well it looks like allah can fuck up even harder by letting the US into the middle east and letting the other religions other than islam spread or letting so many of his people die at the hands of infidels. why do you continually pour your trust into something that has given you nothing. religion is nothing more than an ideology just like one's political views, yet you dont see the right wings or left wings rioting when caricatures of their leaders are made.

also how does my knowledge of islam affect what the exemption of religion to public opinions
Giving opinions on something you dont know about or basing it simply on what you HEAR or watch clearly states that ur an ignorant thus ur opinions are invalid.
 

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@lolsmith- "Isn't it entirely possible that the majority have just forgone the parts of Islam that do preach violence and these men and women are actually following it?" Thats where u seem to have gone wrong. Where is it that says islam supports violence. Islam has never, nor will it ever support violence.
Quran (2:191-193) - “And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]… but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah.”

Quran (2:244) - “Then fight in the cause of Allah, and know that Allah Heareth and knoweth all things.”

Quran (2:216) - “Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.”

Quran (3:56) - “As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help.”

Quran (3:151) - “Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority”.

Quran (4:74) - “Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward.”

Quran (4:76) - “Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…”

Quran (4:89) - “They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks.”

Quran (4:95) - “Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-“

Quran (4:104) - “And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain…”

Quran (5:33) - “The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement”

Quran (8:12) - “I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them”

Quran (8:15) - “O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey’s end.”

Quran (8:39) - “And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion should be only for Allah”

Quran (8:57) - “If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember.”

Quran (8:59-60) - “And let not those who disbelieve suppose that they can outstrip (Allah’s Purpose). Lo! they cannot escape. Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy.”

Quran (8:65) - “O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight…”

Quran (9:5) - “So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them.”

Quran (9:14) - “Fight them, Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to disgrace…”

Quran (9:20) - “Those who believe, and have left their homes and striven with their wealth and their lives in Allah’s way are of much greater worth in Allah’s sight. These are they who are triumphant.”

Quran (9:29) - “Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”

Quran (9:30) - “And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!”

Quran (9:38-39) - “O ye who believe! what is the matter with you, that, when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling heavily to the earth? Do ye prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the Hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place.”

Quran (9:41) - “Go forth, light-armed and heavy-armed, and strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah! That is best for you if ye but knew.”

Quran (9:73) - “O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination.”

Quran (9:88) - “But the Messenger, and those who believe with him, strive and fight with their wealth and their persons: for them are (all) good things: and it is they who will prosper.”

Quran (9:111) - “Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.”

Quran (9:123) - “O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness.”

Quran (17:16) - “And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction.”

Quran (18:65-81) - This parable lays the theological groundwork for honor killings, in which a family member is murdered because they brought shame to the family, either through apostasy or perceived moral indiscretion. The story (which is not found in any Jewish or Christian source) tells of Moses encountering a man with “special knowledge” who does things which don’t seem to make sense on the surface, but are then justified according to later explanation. One such action is to murder a youth for no apparent reason (74). However, the wise man later explains that it was feared that the boy would “grieve” his parents by “disobedience and ingratitude.” He was killed so that Allah could provide them a ‘better’ son. (Note: This is one reason why honor killing is sanctioned by Sharia. Reliance of the Traveler (Umdat al-Saliq) says that punishment for murder is not applicable when a parent or grandparent kills their offspring (o.1.1-2).)

Quran (21:44) - “We gave the good things of this life to these men and their fathers until the period grew long for them; See they not that We gradually reduce the land (in their control) from its outlying borders? Is it then they who will win?”

Quran (25:52) - “Therefore listen not to the Unbelievers, but strive against them with the utmost strenuousness…”

Quran (33:60-62) - “If the hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and the alarmists in the city do not cease, We verily shall urge thee on against them, then they will be your neighbors in it but a little while. Accursed, they will be seized wherever found and slain with a (fierce) slaughter.”

Quran (47:3-4) - “Those who reject Allah follow vanities, while those who believe follow the truth from their lord. Thus does Allah set forth form men their lessons by similitude. Therefore when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners,”

Quran (47:35) - “Be not weary and faint-hearted, crying for peace, when ye should be uppermost”

Quran (48:17) - “There is no blame for the blind, nor is there blame for the lame, nor is there blame for the sick (that they go not forth to war). And whoso obeyeth Allah and His messenger, He will make him enter Gardens underneath which rivers flow; and whoso turneth back, him will He punish with a painful doom.”

Quran (48:29) - “Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves”

Quran (61:4) - “Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way” Religion of Peace, indeed! This is followed by (61:9): “He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist.”

Quran (61:10-12) - “O ye who believe! Shall I lead you to a bargain that will save you from a grievous Penalty?- That ye believe in Allah and His Messenger, and that ye strive (your utmost) in the Cause of Allah, with your property and your persons: That will be best for you, if ye but knew! He will forgive you your sins, and admit you to Gardens beneath which Rivers flow, and to beautiful mansions in Gardens of Eternity.”

Quran (66:9) - “O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey’s end.”


From the Hadith:

Bukhari (52:177) - Allah’s Apostle said, “The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. “O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him.”

Bukhari (52:256) - The Prophet… was asked whether it was permissible to attack the pagan warriors at night with the probability of exposing their women and children to danger. The Prophet replied, “They (i.e. women and children) are from them (i.e. pagans).” In this command, Muhammad establishes that it is permissible to kill non-combatants in the process of killing a perceived enemy. This provides justification for the many Islamic terror bombings.

Bukhari (52:220) - Allah’s Apostle said… ‘I have been made victorious with terror’

Abu Dawud (14:2526) - The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Three things are the roots of faith: to refrain from (killing) a person who utters, “There is no god but Allah” and not to declare him unbeliever whatever sin he commits, and not to excommunicate him from Islam for his any action; and jihad will be performed continuously since the day Allah sent me as a prophet until the day the last member of my community will fight with the Dajjal (Antichrist)

Abu Dawud (14:2527) - The Prophet said: Striving in the path of Allah (jihad) is incumbent on you along with every ruler, whether he is pious or impious

Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah

Bukhari (8:387) - Allah’s Apostle said, “I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: ‘None has the right to be worshipped but Allah’. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally.”

Muslim (1:30) - “The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah.”

Muslim (1:149) - “Abu Dharr reported: I said: Messenger of Allah, which of the deeds is the best? He (the Holy Prophet) replied: Belief in Allah and Jihad in His cause…”

Muslim (20:4645) - “…He (the Messenger of Allah) did that and said: There is another act which elevates the position of a man in Paradise to a grade one hundred (higher), and the elevation between one grade and the other is equal to the height of the heaven from the earth. He (Abu Sa’id) said: What is that act? He replied: Jihad in the way of Allah! Jihad in the way of Allah!”

Muslim (20:4696) - “the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: ‘One who died but did not fight in the way of Allah nor did he express any desire (or determination) for Jihid died the death of a hypocrite.’”

Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: “They are of them (meaning the enemy).”

Muslim (19:4294) - “When the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him… He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war… When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them… If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah’s help and fight them.”

Tabari 7:97 The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, “Kill any Jew who falls under your power.” Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad’s men because he insulted Islam. Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill. An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

Tabari 9:69 “Killing Unbelievers is a small matter to us” The words of Muhammad, prophet of Islam.

Tabari 17:187 “‘By God, our religion (din) from which we have departed is better and more correct than that which these people follow. Their religion does not stop them from shedding blood, terrifying the roads, and seizing properties.’ And they returned to their former religion.” The words of a group of Christians who had converted to Islam, but realized their error after being shocked by the violence and looting committed in the name of Allah. The price of their decision to return to a religion of peace was that the men were beheaded and the woman and children enslaved by the caliph Ali.

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 327: - “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 990: - Lest anyone think that cutting off someone’s head while screaming ‘Allah Akbar!’ is a modern creation, here is an account of that very practice under Muhammad, who seems to approve.

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 992: - “Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah.”


But it’s the religion of peace, right?

.
 

Lolsmith

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@lolsmith- "Isn't it entirely possible that the majority have just forgone the parts of Islam that do preach violence and these men and women are actually following it?" Thats where u seem to have gone wrong. Where is it that says islam supports violence. Islam has never, nor will it ever support violence.
There are plenty of parts within the Quran that state violence is warranted when either under provocation, oppression or in self defence. Depending on what views you subscribe to ultimately defines what constitutes provocation, oppression and self defence. Some Wahhabists believe that violence is justified in order to bring the world under the rule of the worldwide Caliphate, whether it is provoked or not. I'm not saying any of the posters here are of that persuasion, but there is most definitely room within the Quran to justify violent acts. It all comes down to interpretation and that is what is wrong with religion.

EDIT: I may or may not have got this confused with Salafis, but they are quite similar
 
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Giving opinions on something you dont know about or basing it simply on what you HEAR or watch clearly states that ur an ignorant thus ur opinions are invalid.
are you retarded all you're doing is avoiding the question and what part of what i just said is wrong
 

Lolsmith

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Well i dont blv in *life for life*, and our religion strictly prohibits it.
But how about thousands of muslims being raped and murdered in Burma..and let me tell you dats not the ONLY country where muslims are being tortured.
Don't forget Syria bro

That's where Muslims are raping and murdering other Muslims so yeah lol
 
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hobozforlife

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Oh godd its like u guyz keep repeating the same thing over an over.
Waste of time!
 
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